esbaker
New Fan
I love the Others.
Posts: 39
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Post by esbaker on Jun 13, 2007 11:15:40 GMT -5
Does anybody care to think what will happen to Locke in Season 4? I, personally, don't think that Locke will get rescued. I think that he will try to free Jacob, who will become as much as a menace as the DHARMA people were to the island.
Of course, the problem will be that nobody will listen to Ben. Ben has been a liar, as that was the only way he knew how to squelch the evilness surrounding the island. (OK, I admit, I am Ben biased. That is obvious, isn't it?)
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Post by Kat on Jun 13, 2007 11:50:56 GMT -5
Why do you think Jacob will be harmful to the island?
Ben admitted to being a liar. Personally, I don't understand why. Why lie about living on the island all his life? Why lie about not being a murderer? I mean, I know he can't just say, I'm a murderer, but Locke may have actually understood his reasoning for killing the Dharma people, if Ben had taken the time to explain.
I agree that Locke will not leave the island.
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Post by coaxialcreature on Jun 25, 2007 7:36:30 GMT -5
I'm not sure about Jacob. I think he might be harmful to the island because he may be too desperate to... help himself. However that's going to happen.
Although if - and since Ben is a liar major if - Naomi really was harmful to the island, then Jacob sending Locke to kill her would sort of make that theory moot. Because Jacob would then obviously be thinking about the bigger picture.
This is one of the things that I don't like about speculating. (Not that I don't think others should; I just don't find it as enjoyable as talking about what has happened.) There are too many ways for the writers to go. I tend to try and just sit back, wait for what's going to happen and avoid spoilers if possible.
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Post by Kat on Jun 25, 2007 17:26:53 GMT -5
So, Edith, are you even going to tell me why you think Jacob is bad for the island?
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esbaker
New Fan
I love the Others.
Posts: 39
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Post by esbaker on Jun 26, 2007 13:55:11 GMT -5
I said that he is too selfish. He thinks about himself and not about the people. I am not sure that by making Locke the new leader will help the island. Locke tends to mess things up in the end. And it looks as if Jacob is manipulating Locke into the leadership position.
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Post by Kat on Jun 26, 2007 14:38:35 GMT -5
Like I've said before, I don't think Locke wants to be a leader. And, yes, Locke has messed up things before, but that doesn't mean he always will.
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esbaker
New Fan
I love the Others.
Posts: 39
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Post by esbaker on Jun 26, 2007 14:49:16 GMT -5
I guess that he may not mess up, but if past history is any indication.... then.... I think he will mess up.
As far as being a leader, I think that Locke sometimes does want it.
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Post by Kat on Jun 29, 2007 9:54:44 GMT -5
May have to agree to disagree on that one. I mean, maybe Locke would like knowing that people looked up to him as a leader, but I really don't think he wants that responsibility. He's too independenly minded.
And sure, Locke might mess up. But I'd like to think he could change.
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Post by coaxialcreature on Jul 2, 2007 7:36:25 GMT -5
I've been thinking about this a lot. Locke has obviously taken charge when he needed to, but I'm going to have to agree with Kat that he doesn't really crave leadership. He does, however, make decisions that affect the rest of the survivors without consulting anyone, and exhibits other tendencies that can can definitely be seen as leader-like without really leading anyone. (Like the sub-explosion; it seemed to me that Sayid was more the leader of that little trip with him confiscating Locke's back and holding the map and talking Kate down from rushing in. While Locke again takes control, telling them to wait until it's dark, I don't think he's really leading them.)
He does order Kate to go in alone, and Sayid away so he can get what he wants - to blow up the sub - but I sort of think of Locke more like the survivor's Ben if that makes any sense. More of the man behind the curtain, not coming out and saying what he's doing like, say, Sayid or Jack would.
As for Locke screwing up... I kind of think it's bound to happen. It seems to happen to everyone on and off the island. And while Locke continues to grow, and change, I think the one thing that's really consistent is that he f**ks up, badly. Even when he got the guts to confront Anthony, I was like... >< No, no, tell the police. But as Kat said, he's too independent to depend on anyone else. He wanted to handle it alone. And he got thrown out a window, and paralyzed. His independence can cost him, and I think it's where a lot of his f**kups stem from. (Says the girl who's too overly independent and f**ks up a lot 'cause of it.) So, basically, I think he's going to f**k up pretty badly in season four... but he wouldn't be nearly as interesting if he didn't. And can I vague up that last sentence for ya?
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Post by Kat on Jul 2, 2007 10:02:00 GMT -5
Locke does make decisions before consulting others, but don't we all? Of course, maybe he should consult when the decisions he makes affect everyone else. But, I still don't think that makes him want to be a leader. He just gets stubborn and when he wants something he does it.
Regarding Anthony, I think that Locke still loved his father and wanted to continue to give Anthony the benifit of the doubt. That's where he really messed up. Yes, he should have called the police, but I think Locke hoped Anthony would finally change. Big mistake.
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Post by coaxialcreature on Jul 2, 2007 10:39:42 GMT -5
We're saying the same thing. My point was because he shows traits of a leader, one could easily be lead to believe that he desires a leadership position. It's not necessarily true, and I don't think he really wants to be one.
Again, my point was that he changed but still f**ked up. The change was from him being a doormat to confronting his father, but... he just... gah. The whole way he went about it made me wanna slap the back of his head. Very in character, very frustrating. I agree on the whys but I wasn't analyzing the whys. I was just pointing out that although he might change, it again doesn't necessarily mean he isn't going to f**k up. And as esbaker said, given his history, I don't see him getting away with a whole season f**k-up free.
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esbaker
New Fan
I love the Others.
Posts: 39
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Post by esbaker on Jul 2, 2007 12:35:34 GMT -5
Hey, coaxialcreature, I like where you are going with your thoughts. You know how LOST plays on black and white, evil and good a lot. Maybe this time Ben is the black, evil person and Locke is the white, good person. Of course, LOST being LOST, we will see the opposite in a few episodes from now.
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Post by Kat on Jul 2, 2007 12:51:34 GMT -5
I don't think we'll ever see Locke as truly evil. But the writers do seem to enjoy leaving us to wonder about his character. Dex, I see what you are saying now. Poor Locke. He tries so hard. He wants so much to do the right thing. But I think that's just it. He tries too hard. I'm sure he'll screw up again. But maybe it won't be as huge a f*ck up next time.
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Post by coaxialcreature on Jul 2, 2007 14:19:15 GMT -5
Thanx, Edith. And if you want, you can call me Dex. I just figure it'll spare your fingers with the being shorter to type Nods. And they also seem to have a lot of double of characters, like in Buffy. Angel/Angelus, Faith/Angelus, etc. Characters would follow the same path, or act as 'doubles'. Much like I see Locke acting as the 'Ben' of the survivors; they seem to use a lot of the same methods at times. Grins. Yay for explaining things properly. for everyone else, I often times get excited and don't explain things properly so if you're all confused feel free to - OMFG, Jekyll preview - go WTF and I'll try to explain better. I see both of your comments as connected, Kat. I don't think Locke will ever be portrayed as completely evil because he tries so hard to do the right thing. Sometimes the thought does count. *am off to meet my mum for coffees. And I probably need more watercolors...* Later, all.
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Post by Kat on Jul 4, 2007 10:19:46 GMT -5
Well, personally, I don't see Locke as evil at all.
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